Fourth meeting and a small core group of three ladies and two gentleman is forming.
Tue 3/5/2019 2:07 PM
Some thoughts on the sanga last night:
The problem with: "forming" an eternal body: There is no beginning to eternal just as there is no end. An eternal form is an eternal form, never was there a time when the form did not exist....there is "no beginning" and no end.
As far as the use of the word eternal in relation to "eternally conditioned" I consider it a use of the word in an informal way to imply a very long time. In the definition below there is a description of the "informal usage" which is a little different from the actual definition.
I find it useful to actually look up the definition of the words.
Definition: eternal.
lasting or existing forever; without end or beginning.
"the secret of eternal youth"
synonyms: everlasting, never-ending, endless, without end, perpetual,
undying, immortal, deathless, indestructible, imperishable, immutable,
abiding, permanent, enduring, infinite, boundless, timeless;
"the hope of eternal happiness"
antonyms: transient
(of truths, values, or questions) valid for all time; essentially unchanging.
"eternal truths of art and life"
informal
seeming to last or persist forever, especially on account of being tedious or annoying.
"eternal nagging demands"
synonyms: constant, continual, continuous, perpetual, persistent, sustained, unremitting, relentless, unrelenting, unrelieved, uninterrupted, unbroken, unabating, interminable, never-ending, nonstop, round-the-clock, always-on, incessant, endless, ceaseless
"the price of freedom is eternal vigilance" [One of Srila Prabhupada's favorites]
antonyms: intermittent
My understanding is that we are already in the spiritual world simply we are asleep and covered by the illusory energy. The cloud that forms in one part of the spiritual world. Srila Prabhupada's words "revive our original Krishna consciousness" echo in my mind and heart... from the early-on record album.
It is only a matter of waking up from a dream-like state or having the fog clear. I have always had my loving relationship with the Lord but I am in forgetfulness.
Knowledge, remembrance, and forgetfulness are His energies. To revive that loving relationship seems like something new due to the long period of forgetfulness only. So it is not a matter of "creating" something that I never had before. I have always had a loving relationship with the Lord but it has become perverted by contact with the illusory energy of the Lord.
So if that is Uttamasloka's stance, we are "creating" a spiritual body I don't see it that way. If he is right and it is shown from the acharyas that is the case then it will ring true and I will the get the realizations I need to continue on. If it is off and he is reading into the acharyas then it is still good to read his book, just with discrimination. Take what I can use. I believe Sridhar Maharaja would preach that the jiva has never been to the spiritual world. This doesn't resonate with me. My attraction for Krishna Katha is more than just attraction there is a strong element of remembrance also. Associating with devotees "awakens" something. I don't relate to "creating" something.
__________'s point of "What's the use of reading this book if it is not accurate and in line" implying that every word and sentence must be perfect (when __________ was discussing his hesitancy to use the word balance in regards to anarthas) needs to be tempered. New lights will come out in discussion.
Love you all and thankful for the association ... Let's go home, Jaya Gaura Nitai...
Link to Uttamasloka's book : https://www.pdfdrive.com/the-realization-and-manifestation-of-your-eternal-identity-identity-transformation-through-d23339640.html
postscript:
The book came out in 2013 and as to be expected there have been several reviews and much criticism. A Google search on the net will pull them up. Not everyone agrees with everything in his book. But everyone does seem to agree that there is a good outline there for approaching the Vaishnava acharya's writings. Which is what I think __________ has suggested and why we are starting out with this book. A road map.
If I remember correctly __________ who is familiar with the book even suggested we skip Chapter One due to the controversial nature of the subject of "Where we come from." But somehow we are reading Chapter One and all the usual opposite understandings of origins is emerging. But we can go on anyway.
I expect there will be many different views on all sorts of understandings. How we resolve the issues as a group will be very enlightening and enlivening I am sure.